Hog’s Head PubCast #19: Racism in Harry Potter, Part Two

by Travis Prinzi on March 16, 2007

hogshead.jpgComparing and contrasting Dumbledore and Hermione; battling racism in ourselves and our society

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{ 42 comments… read them below or add one }

1 MichaelNo Gravatar March 18, 2007 at 8:17 am

Another fantastic and VERY insightful Podcast Travis. I didn’t look at racism in the HP world like that before! Just another example of the post-modern messages that JK has put into the series.

2 ReyhanNo Gravatar March 27, 2007 at 11:21 am

We could accept that racism in the wizarding world has the same origins as racism in muggledom (ie. reality): tribalism, fear of what is different, cognitive dissonance rising from economic and other inequities, etc, etc.

But, is there a moment in wizarding history we can point to and say: there, that is the first instance of racism?

I think that moment would be when Salazar Slytherin struck the first blow against non all magic students at Hogwarts and constructed the Chamber of Secrets and placed the basilisk in it.

There is a tempting analogy to Lucifer, who would not worship the image of God in Man (wouldn’t accept the divine spirit in Man) and got cast out of heaven for his defiance. And has ever since been trying to destroy mankind. And often takes on the shape of a snake in order to deceive Man. According to Slytherin, half-bloods and mudbloods are impure (i.e. not divine), do not belong with the
pure (in heaven), and should be destroyed. And Slytherin, of course, is a parselmouth.

From that perspective, Voldemort is not the source of ultimate evil in wizardom. He is a johnny-come-lately to evil, a half-blood himself, who is channeling Slytherin energy, but driven by a fairly mundane – ie. mortal – fear of death.

This line of reasoning suggests two things. The evil that Harry and the Order are fighting is larger than Voldemort’s desire to defeat death and dominate the wizarding world: it encapsulates the hatred of non purebloods. And second, the struggle against evil has to go back to where it all started, and involve the founders of Hogwarts, Slytherin, Gryffindor, Ravenclaw and Hufflepuff. Who are, I believe, the deathly hallows referenced in the title of HP7.

Not sure what that kind of struggle would look like. It would be different from anything JKR has tried before. But it would certainly be fascinating.

3 maryNo Gravatar March 28, 2007 at 12:12 am

I think you are exactly right, Travis, when talking about wizards’ racism toward other magical creatures, and how Dumbledore tries to solve this problem. But I still think Rowling is sending a very mixed message about race and racism in these books. Why? Because of the way she (or more correctly, her characters) treat Muggles.

I’m thinking, again, of the argument I was having with Seriously_Black, and the example he gave of his friends’ little girl and her skill in archery. That was an extremely poor example of the sort of gulf we see between a Muggleborn wizard and her parents, and Wizards and Muggles generally. In Rowling’s universe, a Muggleborn child who found she could do magic would (initially, at least) be told she shouldn’t tell stories; there is no magic; it isn’t real. Young Tom was apparently told he was insane. And Harry, in his third year, learns about the Muggles’ attempts to burn witches in the Middle Ages. Further, we have the example of his relatives, the Dursleys, who reject what Harry is entirely and make it absolutely clear they would rather he didn’t exist. Muggles are racist, then, in that they either deny the existence of Wizards altogether or else see them as dangerous, bad and evil – fit subjects for persecution and death. And wizards?

Their attitudes toward Muggles, generally, range from condescension to contempt to active hostility. Don’t forget Sirius Black’s aunt, who wanted to legalize Muggle-hunting! There are real- world analogies here: in Australia, Whites actually did hunt Aborigines, and the “Digger” Indians of California were also hunted by Anglos. In both cases, the whites saw themselves as fully human and the native peoples as less than animals.

You could argue that the “good guys”, like Dumbledore, don’t feel that way, but, based on the evidence we see, Dumbledore is quite as dysconsciously racist, when it comes to Muggles, as any other Wizard. No, he may not want them hurt, but he does not bother to dress in Muggle clothing when dealing with them, never so much as speaks to Petunia after Lily’s death (so far as we know, he simply leaves Harry on the doorstep like an unwanted parcel), and, in the interaction with Mrs. Cole, he deceives and manipulates her, gets her drunk, and then (if I’m remembering rightly), obliviates her. And Dumbledore is supposed to be the best of the good guys.

There’s more. Every Muggle we see in the books is either a cipher or nonentity (The Grangers, the family at the campground), or else genuinely contemptible. And Wizards have no qualms at all about obliviating Muggles. That’s an abuse of power, as far as I’m concerned. I woudl *hate* to be obliviated! Further, as a livejournaller pointed out to me, there are NO examples in the books so far of a happy, healthy marriage between a Witch or Wizard and a Muggle. Such marriages may exist, but Rowling has not seen fit to show us a single one. Indeed, she has not seen fit to show us a single open-minded, intelligent Muggle. And I rather resent that, since I’m a Muggle and proud of it! (Yes, I know – the Grangers are supposed to be open-minded and intelligent, but can you remember anything at all that they say or do other than quiver with fear? Otherwise, we’ve just got the Dursleys.)

Basically, the dynamic I see between Wizards and Muggles is fear – on both sides. Wizards are terrified of Muggles and also treat them with contempt; Muggles, for the most part, actually refuse to admit that Wizards exist, but it’s obvious Petunia, for one, is paralyzed by fear. No matter what is done to solve the problem of racism between magical species, the Wizarding World will remain corrupt, in my eyes, so long as it’s based on hatred and fear of Muggles. And, basically, the only Wizard I know of (among the main characters) who has *never* been shown to threaten, manipulate, or injure a Muggle, nor to make derogatory comments about Muggles, is Snape! Hard to know what to make of that!

4 Travis PrinziNo Gravatar March 30, 2007 at 10:33 pm

mary, interesting thoughts, and that may be a very fair critique. I’d like to add the following things into the mix, however:

Muggles are indeed presented comically and critically – yet at least a few points go against the idea that Rowling has failed on the racism issue here:

(1) Arthur’s Muggle Protection Act. This is considered a Good Thing, and Dumbledore is all for it.

(2) It must be kept in mind that the wizard reaction against Muggles to a large extent is one which they were forced into by Muggles. The Wizarding World hides itself from Muggles and protects itself against them at all costs because Muggles have persecuted witches and wizards throughout history and driven them into hiding. Rowling has said elsewhere that a group that is driven into a minority position by the dominant culture tends to develop within itself its own set of prejudices, splitting itself up even more (like with the centaurs). So we’re getting only one small part of the Wizard-Muggle story, and spending much more time on prejudice within the WW itself.

(3) The “abuses of power” (like memory charms) of Wizards upon Muggles could be just as easily read as survival techniques. Seriously, if Muggles discovered Wizards, it would be all over for the WW. There’s far too few of them. They’ve been forced to survive this way by Muggle oppression in the first place.

(4) If I recall, all of the Dumbledore actions that seem to be prejudiced against Muggles happened over 50 years ago. (I think the content of his letter to Petunia, once revealed, will settle that particular matter).

5 maryNo Gravatar March 30, 2007 at 11:51 pm

‘If I recall, all of the Dumbledore actions that seem to be prejudiced against Muggles happened over 50 years ago”

Not really. I think it was simply appalling of Dumbledore to dump Harry on the Dursleys with nothing but a letter or two in 15 years. What did he expect would result from that? I do think Dumbledore is good, and means well (I came to love him, in spite of his failings, in HBP), but, unlike Rowling, I by no means see him as the epitome of goodness.

I also mentioned the Muggle persecutions. It’s funny that you sometimes seem to disagree with me by repeating what I said! But I do not think Muggles are capable of destroying the Wizarding World. It is Wizards who have developed techniques like “obliviate” and “imperio”, and, in Harry’s history lesson, we learn the Muggle persecutions were both comical and ineffective (except, of course, to the innocent Muggle women who were the most frequent victims – my addition). So, although your interpretation of what we’ve been given certainly makes sense, we can’t yet be sure it is right.

The fact remains that the Wizarding World, as depicted by Rowling, is actually based on racism (it is an Apartheid state) and controlled by fear. I would be happy if her series ended the way Lloyd Alexander’s did, with the elimination of magic from the world. But I’d say I’m one of *very* few who would think so. The kids, in particular, seem enthralled by the concept of magic – but I’m starting to question what it really stands for. Just my two cents!

6 Travis PrinziNo Gravatar March 31, 2007 at 12:41 am

mary, guilty as charged. I very often read comments way too quickly and do not respond properly.

I suppose we’ll simply disagree on whether or not the WW would be destroyed by Muggles. In my view, there are something like 3,000 wizards in the UK – and what is the Muggle population of the UK? Can’t imagine Hogwarts, Hogsmeade, or Diagon Alley surviving a Muggle military assault.

So I guess my view remains that the WW is oppressed and trying to survive. It’s not the ideal situation, and I don’t think Albus ultimately wants it to be this way. But that is how it presently is.

Which brings us back to Albus! Like I said, I think the actual content of the letter will solve this problem. But even not knowing the content – I’m not convinced that Dumbledore showing up and actually speaking to the Dursleys would have helped. I think they would have driven him away and refused Harry. Leaving him there on the doorstep, helpless, added a sense of necessary compulsion to their taking him in. Dumbledore needed this plan to work, and the very sight of him would have probably caused its failure. It would have given the Dursleys the option to say, “no, you take him.”

Funny you mention the elimination of magic. I took up an E-Owl from someone proposing that very same line of thinking in the pubcast that I’m just about to publish. It’ll be up in 20 minutes or so.

7 SDNNo Gravatar April 1, 2007 at 2:04 pm

Mary, why should magic “stand for” anything, any more than a hammer, or a gun, or quantum physics, or any other tool man uses to manipulate the world? It’s not the tool, it’s the choices of the tool user. This is one reason why I, even though a Christian, can’t see magic as evil; if it exists, God created it. Like any other part of the creation, it can be misused; and perhaps it is easier to misuse than other parts. But magic cannot stand for anything; it has no volition to use to do so.

“Nothing was evil in the beginning; even Sauron was not so.” Elrond of Rivendell.

8 Travis PrinziNo Gravatar April 1, 2007 at 5:10 pm

SDN, I think mary is referring to the literary purpose of magic within the Harry Potter books – which is a really important line of inquiry.

Even in the books, perhaps magic is nothing other than a story-telling tool, an alternate world in which Rowling can playfully tell us things about our own.

I’m of the opinion that a magical structure is chosen in order to combat materialism and a naturalistic worldview – that’s at least how it’s set up in Book 1, where the stark contrast is between the magical world and the Dursleys.

In any event, magic really looks a lot like technology in the HP books, doesn’t it? So in that sense, it is a “tool” to be used, and “choice” is the point.

9 seriously_blackNo Gravatar April 1, 2007 at 7:07 pm

It’s noteworthy that Rowling’s conception of magic is largely functional. It’s part talent, part technology, and part skill. It’s not particularly mystical. Moreover it operates according to rules and within defined limits. Some of the cleverer people are able to push those limits (as they do in any other field of human endeavor) but there are limits nonetheless.

In that sense it is basically similar to many other areas of human ability. Like Mathematics or Music etc. You have to have it “in the genes” to begin with, and if you do, it can be fostered and developed by appropriate education, then used in the service of good or evil like any other human ability or technology.

Nothing could be clearer than that in Rowling’s WW, it is not the magic itself that is good or evil, but the ways it is used and the people using it. Much like any other powerful human ability.

In that sense, rather than being *about* magic, the books are about privilege (because being magical sets wizards apart and gives them certain advantages), about difference and prejudice, about race and about the human condition (courage, friendship, loyalty vs ignorance, greed, betrayal). The magic largely provides the backdrop against which these various themes are thrown into relief.

10 ReyhanNo Gravatar April 2, 2007 at 10:41 pm

S_B’s definitin of magic as “part talent, part technology and part skill” is a good one. It leads me to an understanding of magic as a different way of controlling reality – reality including things as well as people. Good magicians restrict themselves to controlling objects. Dark magicians try to exert control over – i.e. dominate, subjugate – other people.

So it’s actually about the exercise of power. What you do with power.

I think that’s the metaphor.

11 maryNo Gravatar April 2, 2007 at 11:17 pm

That magic is about power I can accept. Sigune, whom I mentioned before, has a fascinating (now canon-shafted) story in which 9-year-old Severus (growing up in a Muggle area and smart as a whip) points out to his mother that wizards really can’t *do* anything Muggles can’t also do – the two groups of people just do the same thing in different ways. This is his initial attraction to Dark magic; it’s real power, power Muggles, and even many wizards, don’t have.

But, if good magicians restrict themselves to controlling objects, there are no good magicians in these books. (A conclusion I’ve slowly been coming to over the past three years or so – I do not like Rowling’s magical world.) Wizards of every age use spells to control and punish other wizards. Animals, which are surely not objects, are used as subjects for experiments. As Travis has pointed out in these racism posts, Wizards in general seek to control other intelligent species, such as house elves. And, where Muggles are concerned, spells like “obliviate” really do get tossed around like candy at a parade. I don’t think I’ve seen a single wizard who did NOT seek to control other beings – except, perhaps, for Luna. And that’s why I like her so much.

But other metaphors for Rowling’s magic make me very uneasy. Fantasy and imagination? Why can’t Muggles have that as well, and how does it become effective? When I really got uncomfortable, though, was when I realized (when reading Snape’s Defense class in HBP) spell-casting bore a resemblance to petitionary prayer. I cannot tell you how much I DIDN’T like that! I CAN accept magic as a metaphor for power, but if so, it strikes me as power that humans don’t need and therefore shouldn’t have. Because one of the things magic does is insulate people from the natural consequences of their actions. The Wizarding World is incredibly brutal and violent, and it is so in part because injuries are so easily mended. A kid breaks another boy’s nose, and a young witch fixes it in a second, with a simple muttered word and wave of a wand. Not in this world! To us Muggles, broken bones are serious injury. Maybe, if that were true of magicians, they would be a bit more careful and less inclined to lash out violently.

12 ReyhanNo Gravatar April 3, 2007 at 9:58 am

Mary, I do not share your distrust of magic – most people in the wizarding community seem to wield it more or less ethically, helped, no doubt, by their compulsory seven years’ education and the Ministry rules. Their faults are mainly the faults of the culture – subjugation of elves, marginalization of giants, werewolves, goblins and so on – but cultural norms do evolve; our own history speaks to that.

I was intrigued, however, by your thought that the story should end by ending magic. I don’t see it as either desirable (how boring!) or likely – who would give up power, after all?

Which started me thinking about Shakespeare’s Tempest, and the magician Prospero, who does just that. Here are the lines where he states his intent:

“I have bedimm’d
The noontide sun, call’d forth the mutinous winds,
And ‘twixt the green sea and the azured vault
Set roaring war: to the dread rattling thunder
Have I given fire and rifted Jove’s stout oak
With his own bolt; the strong-based promontory
Have I made shake and by the spurs pluck’d up
The pine and cedar: graves at my command
Have waked their sleepers, oped, and let ‘em forth
By my so potent art. But this rough magic
I here abjure, and, when I have required
Some heavenly music, which even now I do,
To work mine end upon their senses that
This airy charm is for, I’ll break my staff,
Bury it certain fathoms in the earth,
And deeper than did ever plummet sound
I’ll drown my book.”

He also frees Ariel, the spirit who’s been his loyal servant.

But I think that for him the decision is a social one, not an ethical one. He is a man, after all, and would like to return to civilization. Also, he wasn’t always a wizard, unlike in JKR’s world where you’re born with the ability.

Which brings up yet another intriguing possibility: are there wizards (or witches) who choose never to use their power?

Not Aunt P, surely?

13 maryNo Gravatar April 3, 2007 at 2:01 pm

Reyhan, I’m really surprised that you see most witches and wizards as ethical in their use of power. I don’t! When I read Jodel, who said that Rowling’s wizarding world had a pretty clear morality, but no ethical sense at all, I thought for a moment and then (mentally) exclaimed: of course! THAT’s the problem that’s been bugging me so much.

Wizards, in general, strike me as mentally lazy and far too inclined to solve everyday problems that do not require the use of magic by waving wands. And, as I said before, they are casually violent, seem to think that the end justifies the means*, and are altogether too likely to pigeonhole others by the family they come from, their House in school, and – as Travis was saying in the first place – their race. The wizarding world, as Rowling depicts it, is a chaotic, hidebound, insular, and fear-ridden place. A good metaphor for our world, perhaps, but surely not an improvement on it.

* The lack of ethics in the WW might be an essay in itself. I *told* myself I’d be giving up fandom activity for lent (though I certainly didn’t succeed!), so I’m not going to be writing it anytime soon, but maybe in a month or two-

14 seriously_blackNo Gravatar April 3, 2007 at 2:43 pm

There are two points under contention, but I’m not fully convinced of either of them.

Once is that the what defines dark magic is the control of people rather than just objects. The other is that the same distinction separates what wizards can do from what muggles can do.

Starting with the second contention, it’s simply not valid. There are many many muggle technogies that act on people, not just on things. From firearms to medicine (and everuthing in between). And just like in the WW, these can be used in the service of either good or evil – and routinely are.

Similarly, there are many things that wizards in JKRs universe do which are wholly good, yet involve performing magic on people. To use a parallel example, there are many spells and charms that heal the sick and injured. They transform people in ways that are meant for their benefit and done with the best of intentions.

I’m afraid that in either case, the distinction is unhelpful.

I think a much more useful way of thinking about the significance of magic is in Reyhan’s comment about the exercise of power.

All power, whether over objects or creatures – and whether magical or not, can be exercised with love, care and thought – or can be wielded in the service of evil. I do not see anything in the magic that is described in the HP series that sets it apart in this respect from any of the many muggle technologies that grant power over people and things (to various degrees and in various ways) to those who have mastered them.

I think you have a point, Reyhan, when you say that magic provides the basis for an exploration of human use and abuse of power. Any power would do, but Rowling has chosen the WW as the backdrop for a story about essential human truths.

15 ReyhanNo Gravatar April 3, 2007 at 3:47 pm

S_B, I agree that the parallel between good and evil on the one hand and the use of power on objects versus people on the other was not well thought out.

However, before you throw out the baby with the bathwater, there is a kernel of truth in there. To an agnostic like me, hurting other people without remorse is a pretty good definition of evil. The use of power to hurt others, especially but not just the helpless or the innocent, is evil.

I agree that power can be used on others to help them – by healing them, for example. But exercising power over others, even responsibly and in a well-meaning way, gets you on the slippery slope to abusing power. This is what I was trying to get at, although not very clearly.

Mary, I think that JKR has done a pretty good job of showing us a world where the exercise of power is pretty well regulated, through education, by the laws, and ultimately by people’s innate sense of right and wrong. When Harry uses the sectumsepra on Malfoy, he is himself revolted by his action. The unforgivable curses are just that – and they land you in Azkaban. The abuse of power is not acceptable.

Even in smaller matters, we can see the disapproval at using magic to thwart the rules or the principle of fairness: when Herminone confounds Ron’s opponent in the Quidditch try-outs; when Hermione thinks Harry’s given Ron some Felix Felicis; when Harry cheats his way through 6th year Potions, etc.

To me, there is a pretty well functioning system of morality at work.

16 seriously_blackNo Gravatar April 3, 2007 at 5:49 pm

Reyhan, I pretty much agree with all of your points in the previous post – except one.

Speaking as a former teacher, I do not think that Harry cheated his way through potions. I know Hermione says so – but then she is choosing to view it that way because she resents being outdone by him in a subject in which she previouisly had the edge (to put it mildly).

The fact is that what Harry does in potions is *exactly* what Hermione *always* does. He relies on extra information that someone has written into a book, but which is not part of the set text for the subject.

Hermione routinely spends a lot of time in the library looking up hints and information of all sorts that are in books that aren’t the set texts (and even making her own notes about the salient points), which she then is able to draw on in class (and in exams, and everywhere else) to display brilliance.

Granted one might argue that the HBP’s jottings are not published and are therefore not equally available to all students. But that is what life is like. Plenty of people own their own copies of books and study guides that aren’t in the school library – and noone accuses them of cheating because of it. Similarly people join study groups or cultivate mentors to aid their learning – and their academic performance improves accordingly – but that is not cheating either. It’s learning.

On the contrary, HBP shows that when Harry has a teacher who *helps* him, rather than one who is hell bent on bullying, intimidating, undermining and humiliating him, he flourishes and shows a natural aptitude – for a subject in which Snape had previously cast him as the dunce.

What the story shows me is that if Snape had actually done his *job* and shared his knowledge lovingly and generously as is a teacher’s role and most basic responsibility (and in fact, a minimum standard of competence for the profession, IMO), then Harry would have been one of his best students from first year on. IOW when provided with the very same hints and suggestions that Snape could obviously have provided (but chose not to, instead preferring to bully and harangue) Harry flourished.

The fact that the HBP *is* Snape only further serves to underscore the gulf between Harry’s progress when his source of assistance was Snape in person, as against his progress when the crushing agenda of hate (Snape’s hate, which Harry has come to reciprocate) is the one thing that has been removed from the equation.

I believe that the point, first and foremost, is not about Harry’s integrity. It is about Snape and the way in which Harry has responded (and failed to respond, for that matter) to his “teaching”.

Rowling has said in interviews, specifically in regard to Snape, that:

“Children are very aware…that teachers do sometimes abuse their power and this particular teacher *does* abuse his power”

and

“the worst, shabbiest thing you can do is to bully children”.

The key point of the episode for me, is not about cheating at all, but about how well Harry can do when he has Snapes help (albeit passive, anonymous and inadvertent) rather than his active hindrance. So it is in fact a backdrop for a further exploration of the abuse of power (Snape) and its effect on the victims of abuse (Harry).

17 maryNo Gravatar April 3, 2007 at 10:00 pm

I disagreee very strongly, and went into detail about this earlier on my blog. Basically, there is a huge difference between getting information from outside reading which you actually do, and which anyone can access, and using a private crib in class. Harry is using a private crib. And he is quite deliberately stealing *someone else’s* intellectual property, and failing to credit them for it. The real equivalent here isn’t Hermione reading the textbook (something she actually does, while Harry and Ron do not) or getting information from the library. No,the real equivalent is Harry and Ron copying Hermione’s homework. Except that now, instead of copying Hermione, Harry is copying the prince.

This is clearly demonstrated by two things. First, Harry deliberately lies about the book and hides it from Slughorn, willingly taking credit for improvements he hasn’t devised. Second, Harry actually *learns* nothing at all from the potions notes. If he bothered to study them and learn why they worked, that would be one thing, but he doesn’t. All he does is blindly copy techniques he could not have devised himself and does not understand. How do we know he’s learned nothing from the notes? Because, when he loses his ‘cheat sheet” in the spring, he immediately sinks down to the low mid-range in the class, where his own efforts would naturally leave him. Slughorn is puzzled by his dramatic disimprovement – another opportunity for Harry to tell the truth, which he again flubs.

So, yes, Harry cheats his way through potions. And I think we are meant to see this. If Harry were actually *learning* anything from the notes, I would be more inclined to see your point of view, but he learns nothing.

Oh, and it is Harry’s fault, as well as Snape’s, that he can’t learn from him in person. But that is another rant altogether.

18 ReyhanNo Gravatar April 3, 2007 at 10:31 pm

S_B, I agree with most of your main points: it is a shabby thing to bully chidren, and Snape shouldn’t be bullying the children entrusted to his care, and Harry does learn a lot better when not being bullied – who wouldn’t?

Along the same lines, what Lupin does to restore Neville’s self-confidence, after Snape has bullied him into jelly, stands out in brilliant contrast.

Does it not seem to you that Snape didn’t really want to Harry – or anyone except for his Slytherins – to learn from him, preferring to prove that his students were stupid and incompetent? Which, in the case of Hermione, especially, begins to look self-deluded.

I am pretty certain, however, that relying on the information you find by accident in one book is not the same as looking for that information in a variety of sources – i.e. doing research. Harry didn’t research his Potions assignments. That, however, just makes him foolhardy. What makes his behaviour unethical is allowing – and continuing to allow – his teacher to credit his success in the subject to some native brilliance. Even if it’s mainly about Snape’s inadequacies as a teacher, it still doesn’t look good on Harry.

On the other hand, the Potions cheating/unattributed research was not actually an example of the misuse of magic, so I take it back. It has nothing to say about the abuse of power.

As for what it all means, well, I don’t know. Without really thinking about it, I interpreted Snape’s abuse of his position as typical of the worst of the British public school system. I looked at it as a systemic rather than individual problem. However, your use of the word “hate” is quite accurate. Snape abuses all his pupils (except for his favorites) but he hates Harry. And Harry has grown to hate him back. Whether that is something they will have to overcome – good luck! – or whether it will stay in place while the story line moves beyond it, I can’t say at all.

Throughout the series there are three teachers who significantly help Harry master his craft: Lupin, Moody/Crouch and the Half Blood Prince. The fact that two of these teachers are or were practitioners of the Dark Arts, and that the third is a (reluctant) werewolf is not lost on me. Harry has in fact learnt a lot about protecting himself from people who are dangerous to him.

It means something. I just don’t know what.

19 seriously_blackNo Gravatar April 4, 2007 at 12:23 am

Mary, from my years as a teacher, I can tell you that Snape has *all* the power in his classroom. If he chooses to make sure that a student can learn nothing from him (as he does most assiduously throughout five years of Potions with Harry), then that is that.

Harry’s confidence in Potions was never established – he’s come to dread it as hopeless and humiliating drudge. If his will to exert himself in this apparently lost cause is absent and he is over-ready to rely on a serendipity, I’m not about to argue that it’s admirable – but I do not find it at all surprising. It takes more than a few months to build someone’s confidence and engage their interest after five years of crushing hurt and hate.

When you say:

“Oh, and it is Harry’s fault, as well as Snape’s, that he can’t learn from him in person. But that is another rant altogether.”

- it sounds like nothing more than an egregious case of “blame the victim” to me. Perhaps you could afford to be a little more generous – and a little less hasty in your judgement of the victims of vile abuse?

20 Travis PrinziNo Gravatar April 4, 2007 at 8:42 am

As a future teacher, I gotta agree with seriously_black on this one. That’s a really accurate analysis of what I think Rowling was trying to accomplish with the whole HBP potions book incident.

mary wrote,

If Harry were actually *learning* anything from the notes, I would be more inclined to see your point of view, but he learns nothing.

And I have to disagree that Harry didn’t learn anything from HBP. I think Harry actually said at one point in HBP that he’s learned more from the Prince than from all his years in Snape’s class. There you have it.

21 ReyhanNo Gravatar April 4, 2007 at 9:39 am

I don’t think the discussion of bullying by teachers is complete without mentionining the sadistic Dolores Umbridge. As with Snape, I’m not sure whether her “teaching methods” are part of the plot development, or if she’s just another example of JKR showing the worst abuses of the school system. Of course I’m not sure that technically, we could call Umbridge a teacher at all: her agenda seems so clearly to not teach.

Has it occurred to anyone besides me that Hogwarts has had more than its share of incompetent, dysfunctional and downright pathological teachers? They make for entertaining reading, but don’t say much for Dumbledore’s screening techniques.

This is what makes me think the problem is systemic – and it’s JKR’s comment on the abuses inherent in the teaching profession – rather than a comment on Snape per se.

22 Travis PrinziNo Gravatar April 4, 2007 at 10:07 am

Reyhan, well observed. I think Umbridge is Rowling’s satire of the consequences of government-imposed high-stakes testing.

23 seriously_blackNo Gravatar April 4, 2007 at 2:28 pm

Reyhan, I think the abuses we are talking about are inherent in human nature, rather than inherent in the teaching profession per se – insofar as there are similar occurrences in many other situations were some people have or acquire power over others. A few people, given power, are apt to abuse it.

Bullying occurs in schools, but it also occurs in workplaces, in the military, in politics, in families, in cyberspace – everywhere there are humans with power. In HP, we see bullying at Hogwarts because much of the action is at Hogwarts, but we also see bullying at the Dursleys’, among the Death Eaters, at the Ministry etc etc. It goes hand in hand with Rowling’s examination of the exercise of power as one of the key themes of the series – and she uses it as a device to examine human nature.

Overall the quality of teaching at Hogwarts is actually not too bad – there are a few marginally competent teachers – and one or two bullies, but on the whole they do their best. Without wishing to malign the profession (teaching), the mix is not particularly different from what I’ve encountered in a number of real-world schools, both as a student and as a member of faculty. It’s certainly not specific to the UK, much less Hogwarts.

However, leaving aside Umbridge (who is in fact not a teacher in any sense, whatever title she may claim), Snape stands apart from the rest for the consistency, transparency and cold malice of his bullying and other systematic abuses of power.

Rowling, a former teacher herself, has some pointed things to say about Snape’s particular form of self-indulgence. It hits a nerve with her, I believe, and she uses the character of Snape to paint a portrait of some of the deepest ugliness that can be seen anywhere – the despoiling and vicious abuse of the innocent, powerless, young, dependent and unspoiled charges that are entrusted to the care of a “responsible” and “professional” adult. It is a breach of *trust* at the most base level and of the most grievous kind – and I believe that Rowling has no illusions about this.

Harry is by no means alone in suffering cruelty, neglect and abuse at the hands of Snape (though he is singled out for even more intensely vicious treatment on a number of occasions).

24 Eroej KabNo Gravatar April 18, 2007 at 10:48 am

Not only did Harry say he learned much from the HBP’s notes, he saved Ron’s life with a bezoar. Of course, this was learned from the HBP’s notes.

25 Eroej KabNo Gravatar April 18, 2007 at 12:34 pm

In the pubcasts the issues of whether JKR’s work has a racist bias, house elves and DD’s treatment of them are discussed in some depth. Most of the analysis seems spot on, but there may be a couple of points that can yet be made.

JKR’s work is brilliant and she does much to expose prejudice and deal with it. We all expect this to be one of the focal points of DH. But, perhaps, her point of view has a bias established from her background as a member of a more privileged part of the social structure in which she was raised. This is evidenced in her creating a type of creature, in the house elf, that actually enjoys and is dedicated to serving others. Of course, these books are read by many children who will reasonably be left with the sense that many of those who are (or were) enslaved actually enjoy it, in some ways, as the house elves seem to. Beyond that, we are left with the impression that they would be abused, in some sense, if they were freed and treated with full rights (except for one statistical anomaly, Dobby). House elves of this ilk would probably not be even considered by a writer who’s family or recent ancestors were enslaved. Perhaps, and hopefully, this will be resolved in DH.

These issues are also associated with DD and his role as the arbator of prejudice in the WW. It seems at this point (discoveries in DH to be seen), that he falls woefully short in his treatment of house elves at Hogwarts. Few under-privileged people would think that not wanting to shock the elves sense of self was ample justification for taking financial (and personal) advantage of the status quo. A status quo created by the actions of Wizards (assuming that Wizards made them what they are, as in the case of giants being violent). Positive actions are called for in reversing the centuries of conditioning. Active promotion of their rights is called for, a la Hermione. (Maybe they do want freedom, but the rants of one weirdo elf, is not enough to turn the tide. Maybe there is more under the surface of house elfdom.) DD as the benevolent master who is setting the stage for a change, is reminiscent of Thomas Jefferson who wrote great things about freedom but never found the right time to free his own slaves. At the end of the day, they are on the wrong side of the issue.

“I’m not bad. I’m just drawn this way.” Jessica Rabbit

26 Travis PrinziNo Gravatar April 18, 2007 at 1:08 pm

Perhaps I didn’t address this as clear as I could have in the pubcasts – but I don’t think Rowling is “racist” in creating her house-elves, nor do I think Dumbledore is woefully failing as an arbiter of justice. Exactly the opposite, in fact. Check my other posts on house-elves on this site. I’ll try to respond at length later.

27 Eroej KabNo Gravatar April 19, 2007 at 1:44 pm

Please don’t get me wrong. I don’t think JKR is racist at all. Far from it. I only point out that her privileged class bias sneaks through while she is trying to make excellent points about prejudice in general. The use of the mechanism of the happy willing slave is not a racially sensitive one, even though the purpose of it is to make good points involving prejudice. Hollywood realized that the image of the happy tap dancing slave was abhorrent years ago (but, of course there was a time when they thought it was “acceptable”). Although the fantasized house elf is a more abstract representation and very well crafted, it is the same basic idea. It is not wiped clean by writing it in such a way that they really do like being enslaved (although they are not happy about other abuses). That might even make it worse, from the point of view of literary analysis. And what of the marginalizing of Hermione’s valiant efforts to correct the injustice? Give her better tactics but keep her activism.

That leads us to DD (my favorite character, horribly portrayed in the movies since Richard Harris’s death). He is a great man, who tries to stand for all that is good and pure. He is an excellent arbiter for what is right and wrong. But, alas he is a man (as are we all), and so, as he himself admits, he makes mistakes. The keeping of slaves is one of those mistakes. The same mistake made by Thomas Jefferson, the man who penned these inspiring words;

“WE hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.”

Perhaps he thought the slaves he kept were not Men. House elves are not Men.

I have read several of your other postings involving house elves. There is a lot of excellent stuff there. Thanks for many thought provoking insights. But the points made to rationalize DD’s keeping of slaves at Hogwarts are not up to your usual high standards;

“Dumbledore employs house-elves and pays them if they want it. He does not demand respect of them as their usual owners would. He does not even demand that they always speak well of him; they may call him a “barmy old codger” if they’d like. As I argued in my Ollivander essay, House-elf life at Hogwarts under Dumbledore is a transitional period toward the hope of their future freedom (a hope that I think will get some wings and take off in book 7). Dumbledore agrees with Hermione’s views about the enslavement of the house-elves; he just has a different and more sensitive way of working for their freedom.”

He pays them if they want, but accepts the financial and personal benefits of keeping them enslaved if they don’t want. And he well knows that the vast majority won’t want. This is reacting to someone else’s action (of wanting), but taking advantage of the status quo if left to his own initiative. If fact he only employs one house elf, the rest are enslaved (Winky’s status?). He benefits both personally and professionally from keeping slaves. He may not demand respect or to be well referred to by them, but many of them will inflict harm upon themselves for undertaking such disrespectful actions. I’m sure he is either dysconscious on this point or has taken some action to mitigate it but I don’t recall it being dealt with in canon. (Is this an enchantment? Perhaps DD could have broken this spell for them if it is so.) Perhaps Mr. Jefferson would have allowed his slaves to call him a “barmy old codger” as well, during their transitional period toward freedom, while he was alive. The beneficent master is still the master. Slaves and their decedents understand this all too well. The privileged are not always so sensitive to this.

I agree and believe that these issues will be resolved in DH. But they were not addressed in DD’s or TJ’s life time. They were resolved by violent conflict, in the case of American slavery and perhaps the same will be true in the WW of DH in some way, but sadly DD will not carry the banner into battle. We must depend on his surrogate, Harry, of course.

This is but one facet of the ultra-facetted epic that is the diamond of the HP series. As with any diamond it depends upon what optics you use to determine what you see within. One of the main issues on these points is that these books have a vast audience with children. Those children who read only GoF will be left with the mental image of the happy slaves living under the beneficent slave master, DD, who hopes for their better future, but accepts their enslavement and accepts his benefits therefrom and does not work vehemently against this injustice. Hopefully their developing minds will recognize this as a minor flaw in an otherwise great man and not as a good way for things to be in our world. If they read the whole series, perhaps there will be redemption for this one smudged facet of DD.

I hope so.

28 Travis PrinziNo Gravatar April 19, 2007 at 2:52 pm

Eroej, thanks for your well thought-out comments. Let’s examine this a bit:

Dumbledore has a few basic options when it comes to house-elves. He can:

(a) accept the status quo in the wizarding world, enslaving house-elves and demanding they do his bidding, keep his secrets, and only speak well of him. Obviously, he doesn’t do this.

(b) he can entirely ignore their plight and let them fall where they may. If this were the case, over a hundred house-elves would either be unemployed and forced to starvation or employed in the same “racist” way they are throughout the wizarding world.

(c) launch a Hermione-esque bombastic crusade to free the house-elves, simultaneously insulting and offending the very people he’s supposed to be helping.

(d) employ house-elves in a way that is both sensitive to their current condition and progressive, marking what I have called a “transition period” for house-elves. This is what he does. It’s the only sensitive and sensible option at the moment.

The point that I think is being missed here is “psychological slavery.” Rowling has said that she used to be like Hermione – it was the ethical nature of the civil rights issue that mattered, and no sensivity was shown to the plight of the actual people involved. In a situation like this, it is just as much “slavery” to force people to do what they don’t want to do – even if we believe that what they don’t want to do is best for them.

Psychological slavery means that house-elves have become what wizards have made them. After hundreds, probably thousands of years of being told what they’re place is; after having their histories and identities erased by wizards in pursuit of convenience and power – Dobbies are really rare.

Those children who read only GoF will be left with the mental image of the happy slaves living under the beneficent slave master, DD, who hopes for their better future, but accepts their enslavement and accepts his benefits therefrom and does not work vehemently against this injustice.

Um…who on earth has only read GoF? Who would read only GoF? That situation doesn’t even make sense. Order clears the whole thing up, in my opinion, and Deathly Hallwos will confirm it. Dumbledore knows you can’t just crusade for the house-elves. Thousands of years of slavery cannot be undone by legal action. The house-elves wouldn’t even know what to do. This is going to take time – lots and lots of time. Hearts have to change, not just laws.

You’re correct that Dumbledore will not carry the banner into battle – Harry will. But only because of what he learned from Dumbledore.

I’d get into the Fabian Society connection here, but I fear this comment has gone on too long already (and is terribly disjointed, as I’m trying to type it quickly at work).

There will be more on this in the near future, as I’ll be addressing it at length at Prophecy in August and will be working out my thoughts in the crucible of the critiques of my very helpful readers, like you.

29 Eroej KabNo Gravatar April 27, 2007 at 6:59 am

And now for something completely different…… Off we go into the world of total political incorrectness. Hold on, here we gooooooo……..

Some prejudices are good. Wait, wait, wait – hear me out. Good in the sense that they facilitate the preservation of the species. The prejudice against werewolves is good, in this sense. As a factually correct generality, werewolves are dangerous. Even good-hearted, well meaning Lupin forgets to take his wolfsbane potion and could have easily killed Harry and Hermione, and tried to, or at least would have bitten and infected them increasing the werewolf population and thus, the danger. Werewolves are not what they are because they have been made that way by wizards. They are infected with werewolvism by the bite of another of that ilk. They are predisposed to attack others during the full moon by the very nature of their condition. Even the best of them is dangerous. The species of wizards is fully justified to generalize that it is best to isolate and separate themselves from werewolves, in order to maximize their chances for survival as a species.

This is a dangerous line of reasoning, of course, because if one prejudice is ok perhaps prejudice in general is ok. This is just another incorrect generalization, as is the basis for the vast majority of prejudices. Open mindedness must be a two way street or it is not fully open.

30 korg20000bcNo Gravatar April 27, 2007 at 7:09 am

I agree with you, mostly. (Except warewolves are infected with lycanthropy not warewolvism)

It is a self-preservation mechanism to be prejudiced against dangerous things. But in the warewolf case you use, it’d be a better thing to try to work out a cure and move towards inclusion than towards exclusion.

But then again…

Matthew

31 Eroej KabNo Gravatar April 27, 2007 at 7:44 am

Korg,

Thanks for that lycanthropy reference – I’m still learning about werewolves.

You’re right about the cure and future inclusion. Even the wolfsbane potion is not perfect at this point, as Lupin must still miss class for some reason under it’s influence.

So until such time, no dancing with werewolves under the moon light.

32 korg20000bcNo Gravatar April 27, 2007 at 8:19 am

The delicate art of dancing with werewolves.

SOrry about my stoopid spelling of warewolves. They’re the ones who attack boxes in storage.

Matthew

33 korg20000bcNo Gravatar April 27, 2007 at 8:23 am

Well, the wolfsbane potion is only recently discovered we’re told in PoA. And Lupin still changes into a wolf but doesn’t have the psychotic urge to maim and kill.

Still need work, but a step in the right direction.

Matthew

34 Eroej KabNo Gravatar May 8, 2007 at 8:31 am

Do werewolves remain wolves during the daytime when the moon is full?

I’m such a neophyte when it comes to werewolves!

35 korg20000bcNo Gravatar May 8, 2007 at 8:42 am

Interesting question.

Lupin only turned into wolf form that night near the whomping willow when the moon came out. Surelt the moon was full before he saw it or before it shone on him- though it didn’t seem to effect him. And, the moon is full at all times, it’s just a question of hom much we see of it.

To answer your question…. who knows.

Matthew

36 Eroej KabNo Gravatar May 28, 2007 at 8:56 pm

Your comments (Comment on PubCast #19 on April 19, 2007 @ 2:52 pm ) have sparked a burning desire in me to get deeply into this subject and I have been sucked into the flame, like a moth. (Sorry for the length of this, but in the spirit of open and, hopefully, interesting debate, here goes…)

Part 1)
“Dumbledore has a few basic options when it comes to house-elves. He can:
(a) accept the status quo in the wizarding world, enslaving house-elves and demanding they do his bidding, keep his secrets, and only speak well of him. Obviously, he doesn’t do this.
(b) he can entirely ignore their plight and let them fall where they may. If this were the case, over a hundred house-elves would either be unemployed and forced to starvation or employed in the same “racist” way they are throughout the wizarding world.
(c) launch a Hermione-esque bombastic crusade to free the house-elves, simultaneously insulting and offending the very people he’s supposed to be helping.
(d) employ house-elves in a way that is both sensitive to their current condition and progressive, marking what I have called a “transition period” for house-elves. This is what he does. It’s the only sensitive and sensible option at the moment.”

There is a whole myriad of possible options for DD regarding the house elves. Of course, the house elf character is crafted in such a way that it is difficult to come up with scenarios that move them sympathetically toward liberation and thus the reader is compelled to accept slavery as a good solution. Wish that I were a writer of JKR’s talent and imagination but here are a few things DD could do;

1) He could have not accepted their enslavement but let them live at Hogwarts and do as they might (they wouldn’t be bound to any wizard if they were on the streets starving either). Of course they would work, but under no obligations or imperatives. If they worked, appropriate amounts of funds could be placed in a magical trust account administered by the goblins (helping the goblins out by their benefiting from the admin fees). Keep it secret if it is offensive to the elves. The trust would revert to them upon their liberation (next year?). (OK, you can see by now why I’m not a writer.) If we are to believe that they would rather starve than survive in this fashion than there is not much literary truth in this facet of the books. No species, that is not now extinct, chooses excruciating death over a physically pleasant although not psychologically fulfilling life. This would, of course, be quite expensive for Hogwarts. Cheaper to keep them as slaves.

2) He could start a subtle media campaign with ads in the Daily Prophet and Quibbler and on WWN Radio, The Magical 105.7. Perhaps a “Be a Good Master” campaign would be a good start. Then maybe a “Show your Elf a Good Time” theme, followed by (dare we try it?) a “Give your Elf a Day Off” promotion. Expensive, but hopefully sensitively executed. Perhaps an elf focus group could be established to test market these concepts and try to ensure they are not offensive to the elves. Take it slow but move forward.

3) DD could have given Hermione guidance in her SPEW efforts (he seems to know what is going on in and around the castle). His tutelage could have focused her on more thoughtful and sensitive tactics to achieve her goals (isn’t that why the kids are at school – to get guidance from the teachers?). But again he was inactive, contributing to her failure and disillusionment by his omission. Was it because he didn’t want them free? Alright, perhaps he isn’t omniscient.

4) If nothing else, he could have Prof. Binns create a History of House Elves curriculum and require his slaves attend such a class. It would focus on the great and noble achievements of Elves and polish up the image of freed Elves subtly (academia has never used their position to advance a political agenda before, has it?). It would help re-establish and rebuild their self images.

The possibilities are endless. You can be active without being insensitive.

The reality within this fantasy is that DD has chosen your option (a). I forget if it is expressly stated, but as evidenced by Hermione’s leaving clothes everywhere for house elves to find, so they would be freed, it seems that they are enslaved, not employed (except Dobby). Employment integrally involves payment for services rendered. This is expressly not happening in this case. The vast majority of house elves at Hogwarts are enslaved, which brings into play many imperatives. They must do DD bidding. They must keep his secrets. These imperatives come into play by the fact that they are magically enslaved. DD need not make demands. The demands are implied by accepting their enslavement to him. Allowing them to call him a “barmy old codger” is fun (until you have to punish yourself for having done so) but it is a far cry from setting the stage for their eventual freedom. I’m sure DD is not the only slave holder in the WW that treats his elves well. DD’s lack of requiring respect may be moot as well, based upon the psychological enslavement of the vast majority of them (and their requirement to punish themselves for being disrespectful). His actions to help their plight must be more than talking about what is right and allow them to call him a twit. Would Martin Luther King be venerated today if he only made speeches and didn’t march to Selma? (What if he actually held slaves?) Even DD would have to admit that, in the 157 years of his life (~140 adult years), having been able to elevate the house elves to a level where they could call their master a “codger” was not much progress. Even the Fabians might think this a meager pace.

37 Eroej KabNo Gravatar May 28, 2007 at 8:56 pm

Part 2)

“Um…who on earth has only read GoF? Who would read only GoF? That situation doesn’t even make sense. Order clears the whole thing up, in my opinion, and Deathly Hallows will confirm it.”

No one would reasonably read only GoF? I live with my wife and three of my children who have actually not read any of the HP books. Yes, shame on me. But there are hundreds of millions across the globe who have read not a single one. It is no far cry to think there maybe merely tens of thousands who have read but one of the books compared to the tens of millions who have read them all. But should not any book stand on its own? Yes, exposé can be used to tell us what has happened in the preceding volumes but it is a mystery what may happen in the future. We are left with the images presented.

38 Eroej KabNo Gravatar May 28, 2007 at 8:57 pm

Part 3)
“I’d get into the Fabian Society connection here, but……”

The Fabians are attempting to elicit social and political change in a slow methodical way. This is fine for changing a form of government or an economic system. But this is not analogous to a situation where someone’s unalienable rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness are being taken away right now. There is an urgency involved. As the founding fathers of America knew, such is the time for swift and decisive action. You can’t wait for the right time when someone’s life hangs in the balance. But it is ok to take slow measured steps to correct a situation where someone else’s liberty has been stolen? Especially when you benefit from it personally. Only those of privilege, looking in at the enslaved from the outside, would think so.

39 Eroej KabNo Gravatar May 28, 2007 at 8:58 pm

Part 4)
“Psychological slavery means that house-elves have become what wizards have made them. After hundreds, probably thousands of years of being told what they’re place is; after having their histories and identities erased by wizards in pursuit of convenience and power – Dobbies are really rare.”

On the interesting point of psychological slavery; Psychological conditioning can not be passed on genetically. It must be taught. That means each generation is a new chance for change. I don’t know the reproductive cycles for house elves but the ~140 adult years of DD’s life must be several cycles and thus several opportunities to change things, with no real progress. But why would there be any when the only real action, that we have been made aware of, was an over-zealous, insensitive blitz by one well meaning under-aged witch. But ~140 years of compassionate action (like a Binn’s House Elf course to restore their sense of self, see part 1) by one of the leading wizards of his age, might have had some substantial effect.

40 Eroej KabNo Gravatar May 28, 2007 at 8:59 pm

Part 5)

“You’re correct that Dumbledore will not carry the banner into battle – Harry will. But only because of what he learned from Dumbledore.”

We can look at what Harry has learned from DD concerning house elves. He was told about the fountain being a lie and how wizards ill treated their fellows. He was told that Keatcher is the way he is because he has been made that way by wizards, and that that is true for other magical creatures as well. Good points, well made. But when Harry is presented with his possible ownership of Kreacher, Harry rejects the idea. “I don’t want him”, Harry says. DD’s immediate reaction is to tell Harry about the downside to the OoP if Harry doesn’t take ownership of him (a good and valid point). But he doesn’t say word one about any psychological harm to Kreacher if Harry were to free him (which maybe on the tip of Harry’s tongue. I could almost see him looking for a sock. He did it for Dobby with excellent results). As a matter of fact, DD doesn’t raise any concerns at all for Kreacher’s feelings at this point (an overwhelmingly critical point for Kreacher – the direction of his life is being determined – determined for him by Wizards). But DD does suggest he be sent to the kitchens of Hogwarts (which is one of the best places in the WW for house elves). Why? Because it is best for Kreacher? Because DD is working toward the HE’s eventual freedom at Hogwarts? No. He expressly states that it is so “the other house elves could keep on eye on him”. Perhaps he knows he is working behind the scenes toward the elves freedom, but this is not mentioned to Harry, at this critical juncture. Harry, who didn’t want to be a slave owner and whose only deterministic action taken regarding house elves, to that point, was to free one, has been taught what here? Don’t worry it’s ok to keep other magical creatures enslaved, if it benefits us, the masters. (Do what I say, or do what I do?) Harry easily succumbs to his mentor and becomes a knowing slave master. He even gives Dumbledore the benefits of his slave’s work. Turn’s out good for DD doesn’t it? The reader is lead down the path that this is to be dismissed as just the continued enslavement of just another house elf. Don’t worry, they like being slaves anyway. And the privileged go on reading without a second thought. Is JKR playing on our own prejudices to misdirect us and keep us off stride as the climax of DH approaches? Harry frees Dobby in SS without word one from DD concerning the plight of house elves. Harry takes action because he recognized what is right, with no prodding from DD. But at a critical point in the life of Kreacher, DD is strangely silent concerning respect for other magical fellows.

This will all be resolved in the next WW year. The accumulated progress of the last 140 or so years will be swamped by the results to be seen in the next twelve months in the Potter world. Results that will take place as a consequence of the actions to be taken by Harry and his consorts, with the image of DD and his best altruistic words in the forefront of their minds. This will all be resolved, Voldemort will be vanquished, house elves will be freed*, centaurs will be respected, giants and werewolves will be integrated into wizard society (given jobs as nannies, I think [oops, that’s going a little too far - sorry about that!]) and all will be well in the WW.

*I get the image of the munchkins popping out from behind the flowers when Glinda tells them they are free, “the wicked witch is dead”, and they burst into song.

I apologize for getting a little cheeky at the end here – I think Aberforth may have filled my glass one too many times.

41 korg20000bcNo Gravatar May 28, 2007 at 9:46 pm

Eroej Kab,
Not being rude, but with multiple posts this long it makes me really unmotivated to even start reading them.

Is it possible to condense you arguements a little?

Matthew

42 Eroej KabNo Gravatar May 29, 2007 at 7:09 am

Korg,

Point well taken. I’ll try.

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