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	<title>Comments on: Horcruxes</title>
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	<description>Harry Potter News and Commentary</description>
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		<title>By: Arabella Figg</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438537</link>
		<dc:creator>Arabella Figg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Jul 2009 16:37:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438537</guid>
		<description>Since I came upon it soon after reading HBP, I put this quote on a slip of paper in the Horcrux chapter; I forgot to share it earlier. It kind of gave me chills when I read it, because it is so in line with Rowling&#039;s Horcruxes. 

&quot;We scatter parts of our soul when we sin, and if we don&#039;t stop, soon we will find our souls empty.&quot;      ---author Angela Hunt</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Since I came upon it soon after reading HBP, I put this quote on a slip of paper in the Horcrux chapter; I forgot to share it earlier. It kind of gave me chills when I read it, because it is so in line with Rowling&#8217;s Horcruxes. </p>
<p>&#8220;We scatter parts of our soul when we sin, and if we don&#8217;t stop, soon we will find our souls empty.&#8221;      &#8212;author Angela Hunt</p>
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		<title>By: R. Ross</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438388</link>
		<dc:creator>R. Ross</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Jul 2009 18:55:50 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Note:  Jo is talking about Free Will at the end of the saga in Deathly Hallows, she gives her take on Harry’s choice (from the same interview cited earlier).

JKR: One of the things on there was- it&#039;s about the end, and how Harry survived right at the end, when he doesn&#039;t fight, and Voldemort uses the Killing Curse on him. Well, it was important for me to say on the website, I never saw this- as in the finale, the denouement, the moment when Harry faces Voldemort, is prepared to die, and yet doesn&#039;t die- that isn&#039;t like a scientific equation. Harry- it&#039;s not guaranteed. There has to be space, to make Harry truly heroic, for free will. It has to be his choice. The whole thing&#039;s his choice. He chooses to sacrifice himself, just as Lily chose to sacrifice herself. He chooses to pull himself back to life. And that&#039;s his own will and courage. So ultimately, those things, all of them were more important than the magic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Note:  Jo is talking about Free Will at the end of the saga in Deathly Hallows, she gives her take on Harry’s choice (from the same interview cited earlier).</p>
<p>JKR: One of the things on there was- it&#8217;s about the end, and how Harry survived right at the end, when he doesn&#8217;t fight, and Voldemort uses the Killing Curse on him. Well, it was important for me to say on the website, I never saw this- as in the finale, the denouement, the moment when Harry faces Voldemort, is prepared to die, and yet doesn&#8217;t die- that isn&#8217;t like a scientific equation. Harry- it&#8217;s not guaranteed. There has to be space, to make Harry truly heroic, for free will. It has to be his choice. The whole thing&#8217;s his choice. He chooses to sacrifice himself, just as Lily chose to sacrifice herself. He chooses to pull himself back to life. And that&#8217;s his own will and courage. So ultimately, those things, all of them were more important than the magic.</p>
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		<title>By: Lily Luna</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438198</link>
		<dc:creator>Lily Luna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 21:35:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438198</guid>
		<description>All interesting comments.  About Frank Bryce vs. Bertha Jorkins.  Bertha Jorkins makes more sense b/c Vol would have had time to prepare whatever he needed to prepare to make a horcrux with her b/c she was under his power; also it was an important killing to him as it was his first after he came back to a rudimentary body and she also had played an important informational role in his plan to regain a real body.  Frank was a spur-of-the-moment killing, so we&#039;re back to the question of whether he would have needed to prepare Nagini first or if he can do it after the killing.  I don&#039;t know why Dumbledore thinks of Frank instead of Bertha for the horcrux; seems arbitrary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All interesting comments.  About Frank Bryce vs. Bertha Jorkins.  Bertha Jorkins makes more sense b/c Vol would have had time to prepare whatever he needed to prepare to make a horcrux with her b/c she was under his power; also it was an important killing to him as it was his first after he came back to a rudimentary body and she also had played an important informational role in his plan to regain a real body.  Frank was a spur-of-the-moment killing, so we&#8217;re back to the question of whether he would have needed to prepare Nagini first or if he can do it after the killing.  I don&#8217;t know why Dumbledore thinks of Frank instead of Bertha for the horcrux; seems arbitrary.</p>
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		<title>By: Arabella Figg</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438197</link>
		<dc:creator>Arabella Figg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 20:43:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438197</guid>
		<description>908ssp, you have a good point. Rather than a mathematical weakening, there was likely a humanity weakening (if you can consider a psychopath as having humanity). With each Horcrux, Riddle became physically less human, and with his unintended last one--Harry, he even lost human physicality. But he became, as an evil soul, no less weakened in mental ability, determination or emotion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>908ssp, you have a good point. Rather than a mathematical weakening, there was likely a humanity weakening (if you can consider a psychopath as having humanity). With each Horcrux, Riddle became physically less human, and with his unintended last one&#8211;Harry, he even lost human physicality. But he became, as an evil soul, no less weakened in mental ability, determination or emotion.</p>
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		<title>By: Rena</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438193</link>
		<dc:creator>Rena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 19:48:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438193</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;Lily Luna&lt;/b&gt;, perhaps JKR was referring to what Draco said in PS/SS after Harry refused his assistance in making friends with the ‘right’ sort:
‘I’d be careful if I were you, Potter,’ he said slowly. ‘Unless you’re a bit politer you’ll go the same way as your parents. They didn’t know what was good for them, either. You hang around with riff-raff like the Weasleys and that Hagrid, and it’ll rub off on you.’

There is another inconsistency concerning horcruxes, I think. 

After his death, Dumbledore tells Harry: ‘You were the seventh Horcrux, Harry, the Horcrux he never meant to make. He had rendered his soul so unstable that it broke apart when he committed those acts of unspeakable evil, the murder of your parents, the attempted killing of a child. But what escaped from that room was even less than he knew. He left more than his body behind. He left part of himself latched to you, the would-be victim who had survived.’
In the Bloomsbury Live Chat JKR also calls Harry ‘the last and unintended Horcrux’.

But Harry wasn’t the last Horcrux, Nagini was. Whether Voldemort made it by killing Frank Bryce (as Dumbledore suggests) or Bertha Jorkins (as Rowling says) - it was about 13 years later and Voldemort was not in a healthy condition. But this time his evil deed did not weaken him at all, it seems.

&lt;b&gt;Arabella&lt;/b&gt; and &lt;b&gt;Revgeorge&lt;/b&gt;, you are probably right in that we should not try to nail the author down to every detail she wrote or said. It’s not all important to the story. It just seems to be to those who read the books dozens of times and think there must be a meaning that can be decoded in every single bit. And we all tend to be like that to some degree or another ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Lily Luna</b>, perhaps JKR was referring to what Draco said in PS/SS after Harry refused his assistance in making friends with the ‘right’ sort:<br />
‘I’d be careful if I were you, Potter,’ he said slowly. ‘Unless you’re a bit politer you’ll go the same way as your parents. They didn’t know what was good for them, either. You hang around with riff-raff like the Weasleys and that Hagrid, and it’ll rub off on you.’</p>
<p>There is another inconsistency concerning horcruxes, I think. </p>
<p>After his death, Dumbledore tells Harry: ‘You were the seventh Horcrux, Harry, the Horcrux he never meant to make. He had rendered his soul so unstable that it broke apart when he committed those acts of unspeakable evil, the murder of your parents, the attempted killing of a child. But what escaped from that room was even less than he knew. He left more than his body behind. He left part of himself latched to you, the would-be victim who had survived.’<br />
In the Bloomsbury Live Chat JKR also calls Harry ‘the last and unintended Horcrux’.</p>
<p>But Harry wasn’t the last Horcrux, Nagini was. Whether Voldemort made it by killing Frank Bryce (as Dumbledore suggests) or Bertha Jorkins (as Rowling says) &#8211; it was about 13 years later and Voldemort was not in a healthy condition. But this time his evil deed did not weaken him at all, it seems.</p>
<p><b>Arabella</b> and <b>Revgeorge</b>, you are probably right in that we should not try to nail the author down to every detail she wrote or said. It’s not all important to the story. It just seems to be to those who read the books dozens of times and think there must be a meaning that can be decoded in every single bit. And we all tend to be like that to some degree or another <img src='http://thehogshead.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: 908ssp</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438190</link>
		<dc:creator>908ssp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 19:37:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438190</guid>
		<description>L.L. I think we should not try and describe the soul in terms of 4 dimensional physics. For all we know the soul is always equal in size no matter how many times it is ripped. Maybe that it looses it humanity as it is divided. And then all pieces might loose equally. Even modern physics is starting to show evidence of particles having an influenced on particles on levels faster than the speed of light and totally outside the 4 known dimensions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>L.L. I think we should not try and describe the soul in terms of 4 dimensional physics. For all we know the soul is always equal in size no matter how many times it is ripped. Maybe that it looses it humanity as it is divided. And then all pieces might loose equally. Even modern physics is starting to show evidence of particles having an influenced on particles on levels faster than the speed of light and totally outside the 4 known dimensions.</p>
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		<title>By: Arabella Figg</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438188</link>
		<dc:creator>Arabella Figg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 19:15:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438188</guid>
		<description>Would it have made the successive Horcruxes worse? Or weaker? I think LV&#039;s diminished being, power and capacity after zapping infant Harry vs. the strong diary Hcrx indicates that the soul fragments became weaker as each time a smaller soul was split, supporting Lily Luna&#039;s brilliant suggestion and math work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would it have made the successive Horcruxes worse? Or weaker? I think LV&#8217;s diminished being, power and capacity after zapping infant Harry vs. the strong diary Hcrx indicates that the soul fragments became weaker as each time a smaller soul was split, supporting Lily Luna&#8217;s brilliant suggestion and math work.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeni</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438183</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeni</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 18:52:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438183</guid>
		<description>Such interesting speculations!  I like the idea that his soul split in half each time he made a horcrux, which would make each successive horcrux sooo much worse than the first, and would better explain why nobody else had dared do it before Voldy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Such interesting speculations!  I like the idea that his soul split in half each time he made a horcrux, which would make each successive horcrux sooo much worse than the first, and would better explain why nobody else had dared do it before Voldy.</p>
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		<title>By: Lily Luna</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438178</link>
		<dc:creator>Lily Luna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:51:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438178</guid>
		<description>Sorry I wasn&#039;t clear with what I was trying to say about the mind meld - just that a conjunction of 3/32 of Vol&#039;s soul in one location (though in different containers) might have caused the intense mind meld.  Hermione won&#039;t tell Harry what he was doing while he wasn&#039;t himself, but a few days later Dumbledore is worried Vol will read Harry&#039;s mind when Snape brings him the sword, which suggests that for once that year Vol was aware of Harry and may even have been looking through his eyes at Hermione.  After this Harry is bothered by the fuzzy images he&#039;s getting of what Vol is doing, suggesting Vol is practicing Occlumency against Harry again, but loses control while interrogating Grindelwald.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry I wasn&#8217;t clear with what I was trying to say about the mind meld &#8211; just that a conjunction of 3/32 of Vol&#8217;s soul in one location (though in different containers) might have caused the intense mind meld.  Hermione won&#8217;t tell Harry what he was doing while he wasn&#8217;t himself, but a few days later Dumbledore is worried Vol will read Harry&#8217;s mind when Snape brings him the sword, which suggests that for once that year Vol was aware of Harry and may even have been looking through his eyes at Hermione.  After this Harry is bothered by the fuzzy images he&#8217;s getting of what Vol is doing, suggesting Vol is practicing Occlumency against Harry again, but loses control while interrogating Grindelwald.</p>
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		<title>By: Library Lily</title>
		<link>http://thehogshead.org/horcruxes-2266/comment-page-1/#comment-438177</link>
		<dc:creator>Library Lily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:50:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thehogshead.org/?p=2266#comment-438177</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;R. Ross&lt;/b&gt;, thank you, yes--that must have been the quote I was referring to. I heard that Pottercast interview with Rowling, but couldn&#039;t remember enough of the exact wording to search for it.

&lt;b&gt;Arabella Figg&lt;/b&gt;, I wondered the same thing about time elapsing between murder and Horcrux making. I also think you&#039;re right about some plot points being done for convenience. Creating a story and preserving the inner logic is hard work, after all. :)

&lt;b&gt;Lily Luna&lt;/b&gt;, I can&#039;t think of a time in PS where we learn that Lily and James had any contact with Voldemort whatsoever before he killed them. As a matter of fact, it seems to me that the first time I heard anything about their having &quot;thrice defied him&quot; was in OotP when Dumbledore tells Harry of Trelawney&#039;s prophecy. I might just be missing it.

Not that she needs a defense, but just because the thought came to mind: As far as clear recollection of the story&#039;s details and logic goes, Rowling is at a disadvantage against those of us who read and re-read the books. As I know from dabbling in fiction myself, a writer&#039;s mind is a mess of nebulous backstory and potential plot lines and directions that happened in chapter 25 that meant going back and changing details in chapter 2. The best mind-maps in the world aren&#039;t insurance enough against confusion. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>R. Ross</b>, thank you, yes&#8211;that must have been the quote I was referring to. I heard that Pottercast interview with Rowling, but couldn&#8217;t remember enough of the exact wording to search for it.</p>
<p><b>Arabella Figg</b>, I wondered the same thing about time elapsing between murder and Horcrux making. I also think you&#8217;re right about some plot points being done for convenience. Creating a story and preserving the inner logic is hard work, after all. <img src='http://thehogshead.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p><b>Lily Luna</b>, I can&#8217;t think of a time in PS where we learn that Lily and James had any contact with Voldemort whatsoever before he killed them. As a matter of fact, it seems to me that the first time I heard anything about their having &#8220;thrice defied him&#8221; was in OotP when Dumbledore tells Harry of Trelawney&#8217;s prophecy. I might just be missing it.</p>
<p>Not that she needs a defense, but just because the thought came to mind: As far as clear recollection of the story&#8217;s details and logic goes, Rowling is at a disadvantage against those of us who read and re-read the books. As I know from dabbling in fiction myself, a writer&#8217;s mind is a mess of nebulous backstory and potential plot lines and directions that happened in chapter 25 that meant going back and changing details in chapter 2. The best mind-maps in the world aren&#8217;t insurance enough against confusion. <img src='http://thehogshead.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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